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BOTD 3/31/2017 "You Never Said" A DMK Production

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David M. Katz

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Marshall
YOU NEVER SAID
A DMK Production

Your son, Marcus, turned thirteen three months ago.  With the advent of his teen years Marcus suggested that perhaps he was too old for spankings. You and Marcus discussed it.  Spanking is still very much on the table but, for some issues, you agree to try grounding. Marcus agrees with the new routine.

A few weeks later Marcus found himself in some minor trouble and so he was grounded for the next day which happened to be a Saturday.  Marcus was to stay in the house without his electronics and he was to have no friends over.  You and Marcus survived the day and the punishment seemed quite effective.

Last night, a Friday, Marcus was late beyond his curfew. He was supposed to be home by 9:00PM but didn't make it until 9:35.  Marcus said he and his friends were playing a game and he lost track of time.  Marcus said he had silenced his phone and so he didn't hear your call. You told Marcus he was grounded for today and reminded him that he was to stay in with no electronics.

Your spouse had to work a Saturday shift but you are supposed to be off.  You get a call from your boss and there is an urgent matter that requires you to head in to the office for a couple of hours.  You have no choice but to leave Marcus at home.  He is basically a good kid and so you actually felt he would abide by the terms of his punishment.  Since you have no land line you did give Marcus his phone back for the time you were to be away in case there was an emergency. You told Marcus you would be checking his call, text, and internet history and that the phone was only for emergencies.  You reminded Marcus (again) that he was grounded and you headed off to your office.

You arrive back home and see on your front porch:


MARCUS - 13 and his best friends, ANDY - 12 & JOHNNY - 13
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You politely greet Andy and Johnny.  You tell the friends that you and Marcus have some family things to do and send them away telling them to check back another day. When Andy and Johnny are gone you confront Marcus about having friends over and being outside while he is grounded.

Marcus makes the following defense:

1. He considers the porch part of the house and so he says he did not leave the house.
2. Andy and Johnny showed up on their own.  Marcus said he did not ask them to show up and, if he had turned them away, that would have been rude.
3. Marcus did not call you to ask about Andy and Johnny because it was not an emergency.
4. You did not say he could not have friends over. (No, you did not specifically list this restriction when you assigned the punishment. You were of the assumption that it was understood since Marcus had been grounded before.)

How do you respond to Marcus?


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Iconoclast

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Trailboss
Marcus is correct on every point! This is an excellent illustration of why NOT to use grounding, it makes me into a jailer and in effect punishes me almost as much as it does Marcus! Marcus wins this one but there will be no more grounding in the future. Marcus is NOT to old for spanking!!

Iconoclast

db105

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Trailboss
I'll respond that at 13 I expect more responsibility, and that if he is not ready to understand that having friends over is not compatible with being grounded then he clearly is not ready for that kind of punishment, since I can't be watching him all the time. Therefore, from now on and for the time being spanking is back on the table as the primary form of punishment. The good news is that there won't be additional punishment this time.

Edit: I wrote this without reading Icono's answer, but we are in agreement, at least on the consequences.

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jackson1


Wrangler
Submit an early application on Marcus' behalf for Law School.

Grounding is off the table for now and spankings are back on, with a paddle.



Jack

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Admin
The scenario is a little unclear. Marcus claims I didn't say he couldn't have friends over, but it also says that he's been grounded before. I'm interpreting that to mean that he has been grounded and was specifically told that he couldn't have friends over that time.

1) He was told to stay 'in the house'. You are not 'in the porch', you're on it. That's kind of nitpicky, but that's also the kind of rules lawyering he's pulling. I would not punish for this specifically, but I am going to point it out, but then let it go.

2) He knows what grounding means, and I shouldn't have to repeat all the details every time this happens. I'm not going to go over every possible rule and regulation that could possibly apply in any situation, and he should know that. If he's unclear, he should ask. He's just rule lawyering and trying to see what he can get away with.

3) Telling your friends to get lost would be rude. Saying, "Thanks for coming over, guys, but I'm grounded and can't have company. Wanna hang manana?" is perfectly acceptable (and I'm sure they'll understand).

Assuming his electronic records are clear, I'll probably let this pass with a token correction, and a warning about this being his last chance. if there is any attitude or if there is proof he called his friends over, he's going to be one sore, sorry boy before I get through with him.


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18Smacked

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Cowboy
I agree with Icono on the consequences, however, I think I would allow a second chance on the grounding punishment, making sure that it is most clear that having friends over at the house during grounding is not acceptable. If they show up unexpectedly, you either explain that you are grounded and tell them to leave or else there cannot ever be groundings that will "work." (And, the fact is, I bet they get grounded- or spanked, so there ought not be any embarrassment factor.)

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David M. Katz

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Marshall
jackson1 wrote:Submit an early application on Marcus' behalf for Law School.

Agreed! Great point. jocolor


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AFinch

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Sherrif
I actually agree with Jack on every point.

The scenario doesn't explicitly say so, but there is no kid I've ever known who is allowed to entertain friends while grounded. Being grounded doesn't mean you can only play at your own house. While "jailhouse lawyering" may (God forbid) portend a later career, I am certain he knows the spirit of the rules, even if he can find "legal loopholes" in them.

ivor

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Marshall
He is certainly pushing the limits, so I think that it is time to point out that such grey areas can't arise with a spanking and I am thus considering reverting to that in future.

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MemoryMan

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Sherrif
"you agree to try grounding. Marcus agrees with the new routine."

Clearly the experiment has failed.

No nitpicking, back to the tried and tested - starting .....NOW

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David M. Katz

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Marshall
"Marcus, you've still got your phone, right?"

"Oh, yeah, I guess I need to give that back to you."

"No, no, it's okay. Keep it. Why don't you text Andy and Johnny and tell them they can drop back by in say, an hour?"

"Really?! Thanks!"

"Yeah, you should be recovered from your spanking by then."

Shocked pale

---------------------

Yes, experiment failed. Marcus gets a spanking (adjusted for any true time served) and then the grounding is rescinded.


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kalico

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Sherrif
I'm in with jack.....

Ugh... the lawyering although I know I did it with my dad when I was BRAVE enough or would that be STUPID enough..... lol


Hugs kal


squarecutter

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Sherrif
I agree with Jack but for the benefit of my budding attorney I will spell out what grounding entails

No electronics, mobile impounded, no friends over, confined to house which does not include the porch. A further breach could include spanking + extension of groundig

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